Results 1 to 4 of 4

Thread: Another Early Playoff Exit For The Pens And Another Series Dictated By The Opponent

      
  1. #1
    Kipper's Avatar
    Status : Kipper is offline
    Rank : Legend
    Join Date : Oct 8, 2009
    Posts : 67,323
    Threads : 1817
    Last Online : Apr-25-2017 @ 08:36 PM
    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Another Early Playoff Exit For The Pens And Another Series Dictated By The Opponent

    There were 3 keys to winning the series against Tampa Bay ..

    1. Goaltending
    2. Defense
    3. Special Teams


    All 3 failed.

    While Marc-Andre Fleury didn't play as poorly as he did in the 2010-11 Playoffs he needed to be a rock, that difference maker. He needed to be that goaltender that we always accuse the other team of having. That goaltender that seems to be in a zone and stops everything that we throw at him. We needed Marc-Andre Fleury to be Jaroslav Halak or Dwayne Roloson but he just wasn't. He gave up the goals that those other guys made.

    It's not fair to pin this all on Marc-Andre Fleury and I certainly am not, but he could've and should've been better. url=http://www.hockey-reference.com/players/f/fleurma01.html]Fleury[/url] isn't the reason we lost but he could've been better, although it's questionable if it would've made much of a difference the way the Penguins lost their 4 games.

    The Defense was bad in most games ,allowing Tampa Bay free reign to do whatever they wanted in the Neutral Zone. We often allowed them the middle of the ice into our zone. We allowed them to collapse our goal crease and the few shots that they did have on goal where all of decent to good quality. This occured with a healthy defense. Perhaps Dan Bylsma shouldn'yt have plugged in Ben Lovejoy who never deserved a promotion over Deryk Engelland who was part of a Defense for 63 games of the Regular Season that was of the Best in the League?

    Bottom line is that the Defense was supposed to be the strength of the team in the Playoffs. It had to be the strength of the team in the Playoffs and they were often a liability and weakness.

    Special Teams were a joke. More than the Defense being a strength, the Pittsburgh Penguins Penalty killing unit was ranked #1 heading into the Playoffs. That was our biggest strength and it was going to balance what has been a terrible Power Play unit for the past 3 seasons.

    That didn't happen.

    Special Teams finished as a -7. While the Power Play was far worse than anyone could've predicted, it was the Penalty Kill that was the biggest let down killing off just 70.4% of it's penalties.

    The Power Play needs fixed badly. It's needed fixed for years now. Why the Pittsburgh Penguins hired Todd Reirden instead of bringing in a much badly needed Offensive specialist is something I questioned when the hiring was made. Todd Reirden was a Defensive player.

    Why did the Penalty Kill collapse? I've heard a couple people point out Matt Cooke absence, however..

    • We had a Top 3 Ranked Penalty Kill when Jordan Staal was out of the Lineup.
    • We had a Penalty Kill of just 72.2% in the 2009-10 Playoffs with Matt Cooke in the lineup.
    • Our PK in 2009-10 finished the season ranked #9 with an 84.1% Kill Rate. That's a -11.9% difference.
    • Our PK in 2010-11 finished the season ranked #1 with a 86.1% Kill Rate. It was just 70.4% in these Playoffs. A difference of -15.7%.


    The Penalty Kill hasn't collapsed because of different personnel and watching the way Tampa Bay attacked our Penalty Kill all series long it was as if we had another set of units out there.

    So, all of these things helped contribute to the Pittsburgh Penguins first, 1st Round exit since 2006-07 but the question exactly is why did they happen and what problems did the Pittsburgh Penguins have?

    First off, we were definitely offensively handicapped without Sidney Crosby and Evgeni Malkin. Skating Mark Letestu and Jordan Staal as Top 6 Centers is a massive drop off in terms of talent, skill and vision. We knew this heading into the Playoffs. We knew that the Power Play was bad and would be bad.

    The main problem and concern I saw was actually the same problem and concern we had in the 2009-10 Playoffs with Sidney Crosby and Evgeni Malkin in the lineup and a fairly healthy roster (if you can believe that). That problem is ;


    We allowed the opposition to dictate the way the game is played.


    Ottawa and Montreal did in 2009-10. Ottawa wasn't good enough to sustain that style of play but Montreal was. Tampa Bay was this season.

    If you look at how we won the Stanley Cup in 2008-09, we didn't really have a great cast of Defensemen. Hal Gill and Rob Scuderi were never as good as people made them out to be. Alex Ovechkin put up fantastic numbers with Rob Scuderi and Jordan Staal supposedly "shadowing" him in 2008-09.

    What the Pittsburgh Penguins did in 2008-09 and for that matter in 2007-08 was they dictated the attack and forced the opposition to adjust to their game.

    The Pittsburgh Penguins haven't done that in a Playoff Series since the Stanley Cup Finals in 2008-09. Since then the Pittsburgh Penguins have allowed the opposition to dictate the way the series and games will be played and the Pens have gone into full out defensive and adjustment mode.

    The Pittsburgh Penguins will never sniff another Stanley Cup if they continue to allow teams to control how the game is played.

    I know that it is Steigy and Errey but... when they are spending so much time per game talking about the 1-3-1... when the press and media is asking players and Dan Bylsma about the 1-3-1 and the responses are all discussion on how to break it, that tells me right away that the other team has already philosophically and mentally controlled the Pittsburgh Penguins. The discussion should be over in the Tampa Bay Lightning's locker room for instance, asking them how do they break the Pittsburgh Penguins. How do they break through the Neutral Zone and handle our Forecheck? All of the things that we saw in the 2008-09 Playoffs.

    The Pittsburgh Penguins didn't play their best defense where it mattered most - Neutral Zone. When the Pittsburgh Penguins won the Stanley Cup in 2008-09, they owned the Neutral Zone. That's mainly how Detroit was beaten. The Pens forced turnovers in the neutral zone and screwed up Detroit's slick, quick moving transition game. The Pittsburgh Penguins forced Detroit to alter their game to break what the Pittsburgh Penguins were doing to them. Now we are doing exactly that. Being forced to break what the other team is doing.

    That needs to be reversed.

    The Pittsburgh Penguins pride themselves philosophically and schematically on being Aggressive, but you cannot be Aggressive when the game approach to an entire game and series is Passive. Passive is what the Pittsburgh Penguins have become in the Playoffs the past 2 seasons. the Approach has got to make the Philosophy or the Pittsburgh Penguins will be taking part in many more of these Playoff letdowns.
    Last edited by Kipper; Feb-27-2015 at 10:51 AM.
    The Standard Is The Standard and The Pittsburgh Sports Forum Is The Standard


  2. #2
    Steely_J's Avatar
    Status : Steely_J is offline
    Rank : Waterboy
    Join Date : Nov 13, 2009
    Location : Pittsburgh, PA
    Posts : 72
    Threads : 18
    Last Online : Dec-29-2012 @ 09:17 PM
    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Another Early Playoff Exit For The Pens And Another Series Dictated By The Oppone

    Quote Originally Posted by Kipper View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    There were 3 keys to winning the series against Tampa Bay ..

    1. Goaltending
    2. Defense
    3. Special Teams


    All 3 failed.

    While Marc-Andre Fleury didn't play as poorly as he did in the 2010-11 Playoffs he needed to be a rock, that difference maker. He needed to be that goaltender that we always accuse the other team of having. That goaltender that seems to be in a zone and stops everything that we throw at him. We needed Marc-Andre Fleury to be Jaroslav Halak or Dwayne Roloson but he just wasn't. He gave up the goals that those other guys made.

    It's not fair to pin this all on Marc-Andre Fleury and I certainly am not, but he could've and should've been better. url=http://www.hockey-reference.com/players/f/fleurma01.html]Fleury[/url] isn't the reason we lost but he could've been better, although it's questionable if it would've made much of a difference the way the Penguins lost their 4 games.

    The Defense was bad in most games ,allowing Tampa Bay free reign to do whatever they wanted in the Neutral Zone. We often allowed them the middle of the ice into our zone. We allowed them to collapse our goal crease and the few shots that they did have on goal where all of decent to good quality. This occured with a healthy defense. Perhaps Dan Bylsma shouldn'yt have plugged in Ben Lovejoy who never deserved a promotion over Deryk Engelland who was part of a Defense for 63 games of the Regular Season that was of the Best in the League?

    Bottom line is that the Defense was supposed to be the strength of the team in the Playoffs. It had to be the strength of the team in the Playoffs and they were often a liability and weakness.

    Special Teams were a joke. More than the Defense being a strength, the Pittsburgh Penguins Penalty killing unit was ranked #1 heading into the Playoffs. That was our biggest strength and it was going to balance what has been a terrible Power Play unit for the past 3 seasons.

    That didn't happen.

    Special Teams finished as a -7. While the Power Play was far worse than anyone could've predicted, it was the Penalty Kill that was the biggest let down killing off just 70.4% of it's penalties.

    The Power Play needs fixed badly. It's needed fixed for years now. Why the Pittsburgh Penguins hired Todd Reirden instead of bringing in a much badly needed Offensive specialist is something I questioned when the hiring was made. Todd Reirden was a Defensive player.

    Why did the Penalty Kill collapse? I've heard a couple people point out Matt Cooke absence, however..

    • We had a Top 3 Ranked Penalty Kill when Jordan Staal was out of the Lineup.
    • We had a Penalty Kill of just 72.2% in the 2009-10 Playoffs with Matt Cooke in the lineup.
    • Our PK in 2009-10 finished the season ranked #9 with an 84.1% Kill Rate. That's a -11.9% difference.
    • Our PK in 2010-11 finished the season ranked #1 with a 86.1% Kill Rate. It was just 70.4% in these Playoffs. A difference of -15.7%.


    The Penalty Kill hasn't collapsed because of different personnel and watching the way Tampa Bay attacked our Penalty Kill all series long it was as if we had another set of units out there.

    So, all of these things helped contribute to the Pittsburgh Penguins first, 1st Round exit since 2006-07 but the question exactly is why did they happen and what problems did the Pittsburgh Penguins have?

    First off, we were definitely offensively handicapped without Sidney Crosby and Evgeni Malkin. Skating Mark Letestu and Jordan Staal as Top 6 Centers is a massive drop off in terms of talent, skill and vision. We knew this heading into the Playoffs. We knew that the Power Play was bad and would be bad.

    The main problem and concern I saw was actually the same problem and concern we had in the 2009-10 Playoffs with Sidney Crosby and Evgeni Malkin in the lineup and a fairly healthy roster (if you can believe that). That problem is ;


    We allowed the opposition to dictate the way the game is played.


    Ottawa and Montreal did in 2009-10. Ottawa wasn't good enough to sustain that style of play but Montreal was. Tampa Bay was this season.

    If you look at how we won the Stanley Cup in 2008-09, we didn't really have a great cast of Defensemen. Hal Gill and Rob Scuderi were never as good as people made them out to be. Alex Ovechkin put up fantastic numbers with Rob Scuderi and Jordan Staal supposedly "shadowing" him in 2008-09.

    What the Pittsburgh Penguins did in 2008-09 and for that matter in 2007-08 was they dictated the attack and forced the opposition to adjust to their game.

    The Pittsburgh Penguins haven't done that in a Playoff Series since the Stanley Cup Finals in 2008-09. Since then the Pittsburgh Penguins have allowed the opposition to dictate the way the series and games will be played and the Pens have gone into full out defensive and adjustment mode.

    The Pittsburgh Penguins will never sniff another Stanley Cup if they continue to allow teams to control how the game is played.

    I know that it is Steigy and Errey but... when they are spending so much time per game talking about the 1-3-1... when the press and media is asking players and Dan Bylsma about the 1-3-1 and the responses are all discussion on how to break it, that tells me right away that the other team has already philosophically and mentally controlled the Pittsburgh Penguins. The discussion should be over in the Tampa Bay Lightning's locker room for instance, asking them how do they break the Pittsburgh Penguins. How do they break through the Neutral Zone and handle our Forecheck? All of the things that we saw in the 2008-09 Playoffs.

    The Pittsburgh Penguins didn't play their best defense where it mattered most - Neutral Zone. When the Pittsburgh Penguins won the Stanley Cup in 2008-09, they owned the Neutral Zone. That's mainly how Detroit was beaten. The Pens forced turnovers in the neutral zone and screwed up Detroit's slick, quick moving transition game. The Pittsburgh Penguins forced Detroit to alter their game to break what the Pittsburgh Penguins were doing to them. Now we are doing exactly that. Being forced to break what the other team is doing.

    That needs to be reversed.

    The Pittsburgh Penguins pride themselves philosophically and schematically on being Aggressive, but you cannot be Aggressive when the game approach to an entire game and series is Passive. Passive is what the Pittsburgh Penguins have become in the Playoffs the past 2 seasons. the Approach has got to make the Philosophy or the Pittsburgh Penguins will be taking part in many more of these Playoff letdowns.
    I don't even know how anyone could complain about MAF this season or this series. Yeah he got yanked in game 5, but his D really hung him out to dry, and didn't stop when Johnny came in either. Fleury did enough to win this series, but the team did not.

    I think Matt Cooke needs to take a good long look at this outcome. He was the best special teamer, and what killed us in a close series? Special teams. He let the team down when he decided to get elbow happy.

    All in all,.. I'm happy with this team, and I think they're gonna be back in the mix again next year. Hopefully without all the injuries to our big guns.
    Hidden Content and the pirates...

  3. #3
    Kipper's Avatar
    Status : Kipper is offline
    Rank : Legend
    Join Date : Oct 8, 2009
    Posts : 67,323
    Threads : 1817
    Last Online : Apr-25-2017 @ 08:36 PM
    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Another Early Playoff Exit For The Pens And Another Series Dictated By The Oppone

    Quote Originally Posted by Steely_J View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I don't even know how anyone could complain about MAF this season or this series. Yeah he got yanked in game 5, but his D really hung him out to dry, and didn't stop when Johnny came in either. Fleury did enough to win this series, but the team did not.

    I think Matt Cooke needs to take a good long look at this outcome. He was the best special teamer, and what killed us in a close series? Special teams. He let the team down when he decided to get elbow happy.

    All in all,.. I'm happy with this team, and I think they're gonna be back in the mix again next year. Hopefully without all the injuries to our big guns.
    The problem is that while I won't blame Fleury for any of the loses, whenever his stats suck *** it's always the Defenses fault. Guess what? You're a goalie. If you got perfect Defense all of the time you wouldn't be needed. We could start some scrub making $750K. MAF is a big money, "elite" 1st round goaltender, he is supposed to bail out his defense when they fail. Why is it that every team the Pens seem to play in the playoffs always have a goaltender that "stands on their head"? We should be getting that from MAF.

    so yes, MAF was part of the problem, he could've been better and should've been better. He needs to be that rock, that wall that the opponents goaltender is.

    Matt Cooke doesn't make a difference. This Penalty Kill as i stated in the Article collapsed the exact same way last season with Matt Cooke in the lineup. Special Teams did cost us but it wasn't because of personnel. Maybe the PP is a little better with Sid and/or Geno in the lineup but it was a terrible PP with both of those guys in the lineup this year and for the past 2 seasons. The PP needs redesigned and re-coached. The PK's collapse is really a mystery

    Why did the Penalty Kill collapse? I've heard a couple people point out Matt Cooke absence, however..

    • We had a Top 3 Ranked Penalty Kill when Jordan Staal was out of the Lineup.
    • We had a Penalty Kill of just 72.2% in the 2009-10 Playoffs with Matt Cooke in the lineup.
    • Our PK in 2009-10 finished the season ranked #9 with an 84.1% Kill Rate. That's a -11.9% difference.
    • Our PK in 2010-11 finished the season ranked #1 with a 86.1% Kill Rate. It was just 70.4% in these Playoffs. A difference of -15.7%.
    Fully healthy Pens team, another upgrade at Wing at the expense of someone like Staal, one of Lovejoy/Niskanen gone from the team with the remainder as the 7th D and Engelland and Depres in the lineup. Replace Matt Cooke with someone with a couple of brain cells that can kill penalties and be a presence physically and I really don't see many other teams that can beat the Pens.
    The Standard Is The Standard and The Pittsburgh Sports Forum Is The Standard


  4. #4
    (419)BlackNGold's Avatar
    Status : (419)BlackNGold is offline
    Rank : Legend
    Join Date : Oct 25, 2009
    Location : NW Ohio
    Posts : 18,418
    Threads : 206
    Last Online : Jul-16-2017 @ 01:31 PM
    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Another Early Playoff Exit For The Pens And Another Series Dictated By The Oppone

    Quote Originally Posted by Kipper View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    First off, we were definitely offensively handicapped without Sidney Crosby and Evgeni Malkin.
    ^^^^^^^^^^
    That's why we lost the series. I said early on, when it looked like it could be TB, that I'd rather face Buffalo or NYR or someone more "offensively challenged". I figured TB would get their goals, but could the Pens get theirs?

    Combine that with TB's hot goalie and the Pens were done.

    It would have been nice to win a round seeing they were up 3-1 in games, but I think after two home losses, it finally clicked w/TB on how much effort and work it takes to win a playoff game. That hard work has carried over to their series with the Capitals. IMO, that continued effort and good fortune, by TB, has taken some of the sting out of the Pens losing.

Quick Reply Quick Reply

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Members who have read this thread: 0

There are no members to list at the moment.

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •