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Thread: Trade Doumit??

      
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    Default Trade Doumit??

    The latest update from Ken Rosenthal's and Jon Paul Morosi's blog at FOX Sports indicates that the Pittsburgh Pirates are willing to trade Ryan Doumit.

    Rosenthal and Morosi hear that multiple teams asked about Doumit's availability at this week's GM meetings, and that the Pirates "would not hesitate" to move him for the right package.

    The 28-year-old struggled through an injury-plagued 2009 campaign, posting a .250/.299/.414 line in only 75 games. He's just one year removed, however, from a .318/.357/.501 season in which he played almost exclusively behind the plate. His ability to play multiple positions (including catcher), combined with his power, could make him an attractive option to a handful of teams. The FOX report names the Giants, Mariners, and Rays as good fits, though it doesn't confirm that any of the three teams have expressed interest.

    Some of my questions/concerns:

    #1. Can a combination of Jaramillo, and Diaz be effective enough to last the 2010 year?
    #2. Can Clement's knees be healthy enough to be back behind the plate full time again?
    #3. How does this effect Tony Sanchez's time-line? Are they gonna try and push him through the system now?
    #4. Can the Bucs get equal value for a 2008 Ryan Doumit or do they have to take a hit?
    #5. Where are they gonna replace the offensive production of a healthy Ryan doumit in the lineup or are they just willing to totally disregard 2010 in order to make a push in 2011?
    #6. With regards to offensive production, are they banking on improvements from Cutch, Milledge, Jones, LaRoche and Aki along with the emergence of Alvarex and Tabata?

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    Default Re: Trade Doumit??

    I think Jaramillo and Diaz would be plenty behind the plate, honestly.

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    Default Re: Trade Doumit??

    Quote Originally Posted by dcm8299 View Post
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    Some of my questions/concerns:

    #1. Can a combination of Jaramillo, and Diaz be effective enough to last the 2010 year?
    #2. Can Clement's knees be healthy enough to be back behind the plate full time again?
    #3. How does this effect Tony Sanchez's time-line? Are they gonna try and push him through the system now?
    #4. Can the Bucs get equal value for a 2008 Ryan Doumit or do they have to take a hit?
    #5. Where are they gonna replace the offensive production of a healthy Ryan doumit in the lineup or are they just willing to totally disregard 2010 in order to make a push in 2011?
    #6. With regards to offensive production, are they banking on improvements from Cutch, Milledge, Jones, LaRoche and Aki along with the emergence of Alvarex and Tabata?


    This is great news. Can we package him with Matt Capps?

    1) Jaramillio and Diaz are an adequate tandem for the next year or two. Also, Clement still thinks he can catch.

    2) I don't think this will cause them to rush Sanchez. Jaramillio and Diaz are solid.

    3) Doumit's value is definitely diminished not only by his injuries but by his run-in with Russell last season. Please trade him anyway....

    4) When have the Pirates ever had the offensive production of a "healthy Ryan Doumit"? Can't "replace" what you never had.

    Buh-bye Ryan.

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    Default Re: Trade Doumit??

    Quote Originally Posted by dcm8299 View Post
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    Some of my questions/concerns:

    #1. Can a combination of Jaramillo, and Diaz be effective enough to last the 2010 year?

    Defensively. Sure. Both are probably better defensively. Doumit has the better arm. Thing is, the probability of Doumit only playing 75 games next year is much higher than him playing the amount he did in 2008.

    #2. Can Clement's knees be healthy enough to be back behind the plate full time again?

    Probably not. I wouldn't even attempt him as catcher to be honest.

    #3. How does this effect Tony Sanchez's time-line? Are they gonna try and push him through the system now?

    Doubt it. I mean, Huntington has been a lot more aggressive moving players through the system but I think they will stick to the development plan they've had all along for Sanchez

    #4. Can the Bucs get equal value for a 2008 Ryan Doumit or do they have to take a hit?

    They're going to take a hit. Doumit had perhaps his career year that season and was healthy, so he was at peak value. He's not at peak value now after a bad 2009 season and the injury. We won't get a trade now what we could have had we traded Doumit before the 2009 season.

    #5. Where are they gonna replace the offensive production of a healthy Ryan doumit in the lineup or are they just willing to totally disregard 2010 in order to make a push in 2011?

    The key word here is "healthy". You can't really look at Ryan Doumt and project him based on a full healthy season cause his past dictates that is tough to achieve. He's built like a glass house. Realistically you might want to place Doumit's projections somewhere between 2007 and 2009's numbers - .273 batting average, 10 homers, OPS around .780, obp in the .320's, Slugging percentage around .450 . It's offense but I'm not sure that you're losing entirely that much offense without him unless he somehow matched his 2008 season which I can't see anyone realistically projecting for Doumit.

    #6. With regards to offensive production, are they banking on improvements from Cutch, Milledge, Jones, LaRoche and Aki along with the emergence of Alvarex and Tabata?

    Most definitely.

    Milledge hit well last year and this season fully healed he should be able to hit continue to hit well and add the power he was missing last year.

    Jones is anyone's guess. Nobody has any idea if Garrett Jones had a fluke season last year. the only way to tell is playing him.

    The only question regarding Cutch is a sophomore slump, but we all have seen that he has the tools to easily duplicate last season and produce more this year.

    Laroche is much like Milledge. He started showing flashes of more power towards the end of the season and like Miledge, was coming off an injury that took away some power. It's possible that more power could emerge from LaRoche and it's not unrealistic that Laroche could hit extremely well since he has numbers that show a guy that makes excellent contact. so luck can go both ways for him.

    Iwamura, if he stays healthy will hit above average and provide solid defense.

    Tabata we might see around the same time we saw Cutch last year make his MLB debut, provided he stays healthy and produces. That's the earliest I think we'll see him.

    Alvarez, I'm thinking they will give him more time. Anything is possible with both Tabata and Alvarez cracking the lineup at some point this upcoming season but I'm also not going to impatiently wait for it. I just want both of those guys developing all of their skills and being as ready as someone like Cutch was when it's their turn

    My guesses

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    Default Re: Trade Doumit??

    Im all for it if the return is good enough.
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    Default Re: Trade Doumit??

    I don't think I like the idea of trading him at this point, but my thoughts are entirely dependent on what the return would be. I feel like Doumit's value is at a fairly low point right now. From the sounds of things it seems like there are several teams interested, which would likely increase offers at least a bit.

    I'm not nearly as impressed with the Jaramillo/Diaz team as some people seem to be. Both are decent backups, which is rare in MLB, but neither is much more than that. Two backup catchers is a nice luxury when your starter gets hurt, but when two backup catchers are your starter it's not a good thing. I wouldn't mind if they're just holding the spot for Tony Sanchez, though. Of course, Sanchez still has to hit at the AA level and above before we can think about that.

    Rob Biertempfel of the Trib says he expects a trade to happen by January.
    Last edited by jnn123; Nov-13-2009 at 02:11 PM.

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    Default Re: Trade Doumit??

    Quote Originally Posted by jnn123 View Post
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    I don't think I like the idea of trading him at this point, but my thoughts are entirely dependent on what the return would be. I feel like Doumit's value is at a fairly low point right now. From the sounds of things it seems like there are several teams interested, which would likely increase offers at least a bit.

    I'm not nearly as impressed with the Jaramillo/Diaz team as some people seem to be. Both are decent backups, which is rare in MLB, but neither is much more than that. Two backup catchers is a nice luxury when your starter gets hurt, but when two backup catchers are your starter it's not a good thing. I wouldn't mind if they're just holding the spot for Tony Sanchez, though. Of course, Sanchez still has to hit at the AA level and above before we can think about that.

    Rob Biertempfel of the Trib says he expects a trade to happen by January.
    Jaramillo and Diaz are decent backups but the problem with having Doumit in the lineup is that it forces those guys for a long period of time to be starters anyways. There's in general IMO too much reliance on Doumit being in the lineup which is something he struggles to do. He's penciled in before the season starts as the #4 hitter. He's relied upon to be that and he misses too many games that leaves that hole.

    If I had any faith that Doumit could play a full season, I'd think differently as well, but as strange as this sounds, Doumit's unreliability I feel, holds this team back

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    Default Re: Trade Doumit??

    Has he been traded yet???

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    Default Re: Trade Doumit??

    trade him, ill take a warm bullpen body any day of the week

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    Default Re: Trade Doumit??

    Quote Originally Posted by tocchet92 View Post
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    This is great news. Can we package him with Matt Capps?

    1) Jaramillio and Diaz are an adequate tandem for the next year or two. Also, Clement still thinks he can catch.

    2) I don't think this will cause them to rush Sanchez. Jaramillio and Diaz are solid.

    3) Doumit's value is definitely diminished not only by his injuries but by his run-in with Russell last season. Please trade him anyway....

    [HIGH-LIGHT]4) When have the Pirates ever had the offensive production of a "healthy Ryan Doumit"? Can't "replace" what you never had.
    [/HIGH-LIGHT]
    Buh-bye Ryan.
    You said exactly what I had been struggling to say. Thanks!

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    Default Re: Trade Doumit??

    Quote Originally Posted by jnn123 View Post
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    I don't think I like the idea of trading him at this point, but my thoughts are entirely dependent on what the return would be. I feel like Doumit's value is at a fairly low point right now. From the sounds of things it seems like there are several teams interested, which would likely increase offers at least a bit.

    I'm not nearly as impressed with the Jaramillo/Diaz team as some people seem to be. Both are decent backups, which is rare in MLB, but neither is much more than that. Two backup catchers is a nice luxury when your starter gets hurt, but when two backup catchers are your starter it's not a good thing. I wouldn't mind if they're just holding the spot for Tony Sanchez, though. Of course, Sanchez still has to hit at the AA level and above before we can think about that.

    Rob Biertempfel of the Trib says he expects a trade to happen by January.
    I would agree with this view...BUT...I just look at the Freddy Sanchez trade. We got a TON for Freddy who, while he's a great player when healthy, has trouble staying healthy as of late.

    Same could be said for Doumit who is younger too...and the contract isn't as much of an issue with him.

    Just sayin.
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    Default Re: Trade Doumit??

    Quote Originally Posted by BigBen2112 View Post
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    I would agree with this view...BUT...I just look at the Freddy Sanchez trade. We got a TON for Freddy who, while he's a great player when healthy, has trouble staying healthy as of late.

    Same could be said for Doumit who is younger too...and the contract isn't as much of an issue with him.

    Just sayin.
    i woudn't expect anything in the same ballpark has far as a return for Doumit. guy is annually injured compared to freddy geting old and injured. Freddy hasnt really had a bad number year. sure, his numbers have been down but thats because of him hitting over .300. doumit had a down year last season.

    dont expect another Alderson in return

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    Default Re: Trade Doumit??

    Quote Originally Posted by Kipper View Post
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    i woudn't expect anything in the same ballpark has far as a return for Doumit. guy is annually injured compared to freddy geting old and injured. Freddy hasnt really had a bad number year. sure, his numbers have been down but thats because of him hitting over .300. doumit had a down year last season.

    dont expect another Alderson in return
    Oh neither would I. However, I do think you can still get a good return in general...and the shear impressiveness in the return for Sanchez who is older and oft-injured makes a good return for Doumit all the more "likely" (I use likely here b/c I am not sure what other word works).
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    Default Re: Trade Doumit??

    Fox Sports says Pirates and Brewers also talked about trading Doumit for JJ Hardy. Apparently in the minds of the Brewers Carlos Gomez > Ryan Doumit. I don't know that I would have been a huge fan of that deal anyway.

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    Default Re: Trade Doumit??

    Quote Originally Posted by jnn123 View Post
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    Fox Sports says Pirates and Brewers also talked about trading Doumit for JJ Hardy. Apparently in the minds of the Brewers Carlos Gomez > Ryan Doumit. I don't know that I would have been a huge fan of that deal anyway.
    I would agree with you there. I am not sure I would have liked that either...but that is, indeed, a strange deal if the Brewers would choose Gomez over Doumit or Capps (well...LOL)............maybe we wanted more and the "more" that we wanted was too much. Also, they may have taken less to NOT trade within their division.
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