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Thread: It's Time For LeBeau's Pass Defense To Step Up - Revised

      
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    Default It's Time For LeBeau's Pass Defense To Step Up - Revised

    Every week and heck, almost every day I hear or see this endless whine from Steelers Nation about wanting to fire Bruce Arians or some Monday morning GM complaining about some specific play that happened to not work during the game. It's constant. It's to be expected. It's simple for general "common" fans to do. Point a finger at and blame what is the easiest target. Bruce Arians has certainly made that easy to do. It takes little thinking and it allows the typical knee-jerk reaction fan a simple outlet to vent frustration without having to use very much of their brain. After consuming a lot of beer and alcohol during games, using the brain directly afterwards or even the next day is asking a lot anyways!

    Mind you, I'm not here to support Bruce Arians. I believe the Steelers have more talent that what they are achieving production wise as far as "scoring" but the Pittsburgh Steelers haven't really been great on offense historically. Without looking at stats you'd have to probably go back to 1979 to find the Steelers leading the NFL in scoring. The offense is usually never as good as what the "common" fans wants, thinks and expects it to be. No matter who the Offensive Coordinator is. It could always be worse too. Remember Ray Sherman and Joe Walton? 2005, 2008 and definitely 1995 were all mediocre/average type offenses. I for one would've liked to have seen Bruce Arians fired yesterday but to continue to complain about him would be simply repeating the same opinion over and over again. I've researched and typed out enough stats over the past 4 seasons worth of Bruce Arians to make my case that he's simply not an adequate Offensive Coordinator. At some point repeating the same things as most fans have do and are doing, one begins to enter a psychotic stage like the crazy guy that mumbles the same things over and over to himself.

    Steeler Nation instead of spending all of their time focusing on the Offense and Bruce Arians should be spending all of their time directing focus on the Defense. I know that's taboo to even think negatively about the Steelers Defense or even suggest that Dick LeBeau is not putting forth an adequate enough effort as a Defensive Coordinator in regards to our Passing Defense and it's results. However, the Defense that has problems stopping the pass, holding leads and come the Playoffs, won't have the Cleveland Browns type Offenses to pad their stats. They will be facing teams like the New England Patriots or New Orleans Saints type offenses that are pass heavy like the San Diego Chargers or Indianapolis Colts and then what? We aren't built offensively for shoot outs. Not when the WR's are a quickly aging Hines Ward, an over the hill Antwan Randel El, 2 very inconsistent rookies in Sanders and Brown and your lone stud in Mike Wallace. Not happening.

    In 2010 so far the Steelers have faced Two top 10 Passing Offenses : New Orleans Saints and New England Patriots. In the playoffs the Steelers very well could face the Top 2 (as of today) Passing Offenses in the league - Indianapolis and San Diego. Facing the Saints and Patriots, this is how our Pass Defense faired...


    It's this simple. We won't beat teams like this that throw the ball this well and if we had the Air Coryell offense of the late 70's and early 80's or the Dan Marino offenses of his entire career we would suffer the same fate as those teams too - Poor Pass Defense = Loses. We'd just lose 54-45 and I'm sure some half brained "common" fan would find a way to pin the loss on the Offense as well.

    If you took the numbers against the Steelers from all of the QB's this year that are in Passing Offenses ranked 15 or better and averaged them out, this is how our Pass Defense is doing ...

    That won't get you to the next round in the playoffs.

    If the Steelers want to go deep in the Playoffs, it is the Defense that is going to have to improve and live up to the standards that are expected. Yes, the Offense needs to do it'[s part, needs to do it's job, but when the strength of your team - Defense can't stop the Pass you are going to have more issues than some common fans going onto Message Boards and Blogs questioning specific plays Bruce Arians called in which the end result was unsuccessful.

    The beauty of the Playoffs however is that anything can happen. Ask the 2004, 2005, 1994 Pittsburgh Steelers. Ask the 1989 Houston Oilers, 2005 Indianapolis Colts, 2001 New England Patriots, 2007 New York Giants, any of the 1980's Los Angeles Rams teams.

    EDIT | REVISION


    Since this Article has come out most of the time has been spent of course ignoring the Defense and doing the "common" thing and blaming Bruce Arians for everything from Global Warming to Middle eastern violence One of the most obviously brought up items is that ;

    "The Defense/LeBeau isn't the problem, Bruce Arians is"

    or

    "Why aren't you as concerned about the Offense?"

    First off, this Blog Post pertained to the Pass Defense itself. That was the Topic, so discussing the Offense would be straying a full 360 from the Topic at hand. Secondly, I'm not worried about the Offense, not as much as I am worried about the Pass Defense. The Reasons for this is that since the last time the Steelers made the Playoffs in 2008, the Pass Defense has plummeted while the Offense has either improved statistically or stayed the same. We already know that we could win a Super Bowl with 2008 Offensive Production. Go back to 2005, another Offense that could be summed up as being fairly average and we know we can win the Superbowl with that type of Offense.

    What nobody appears to be concerned with is that the Steelers do not possess the Pass Defense they had in 2008. Here are some numbers..

    It's not night and day but it is pretty close. It would be inconsiderate to not question whether we could advance to the Superbowl in 2008, let alone win it with that Pass Defense.

    What about the Offense? Here's some numbers on that too...

    The Offense has improved in just about every statistical category except for Points per game which has been the bigger problem with Bruce Arians' offenses in general. They aren't efficient but they will pad Ben Roethlisberger's yardage stats. Points Per Game themselves are relatively the same as they were in 2008 and we already have proven to be able to win with that sort of Offensive production.

    Every team has their own destiny. I'm not suggesting that we couldn't overcome the Pass Defense, I am simply pointing out that at this point of the season looking at the playoffs and the Passing Games that we will likely face, the concern for Steelers should be our Pass Defense
    Last edited by Kipper; Oct-09-2012 at 08:45 AM. Reason: Added more
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    Default Re: It's Time For LeBeau's Pass Defense To Step Up

    Right it's time to start blaming Lebeau . Here is a little stat for you.

    Patriots
    21st in points allowed
    28th in total yards allowed
    30th in passing yards allowed
    15th in rushing yards allowed

    12-2, beat teams like the Steelers, Jets, Ravens, Chargers, Colts, Bears & Packers and have a firm grasp on the #1 seed. When the offense is clicking and scoring points for the defense does it really ****ing matter about the stats?


    Steelers
    2nd in points allowed
    3rd in total yards allowed
    24th in passing yards allowed
    1st in rushing yards allowed

    10-4 and hanging on for dear life.


    Your absolutely right we need to blame Lebeau.

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    Default Re: It's Time For LeBeau's Pass Defense To Step Up

    Then it's settled, we all agree Arians and the offense are under achievers.


    I've been on Lebeau and his defense for sometime now. It just isn't that they can't defend the pass it's the entire way they seem to lose these games.

    Giving too much cushion

    Players that can't tackle

    Out of position

    Lack of a pass rush

    Not enough blitzing

    Never finding the anwser to stop Tom Brady and the cheats despite the head coach

    Just seems like some games they are so in tune and then other games, they are totally off in a different direction.

    Here, this was for all you Arian lovers.

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    Default Re: It's Time For LeBeau's Pass Defense To Step Up

    Quote Originally Posted by fezziwig View Post
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    Then it's settled, we all agree Arians and the offense are under achievers.


    I've been on Lebeau and his defense for sometime now. It just isn't that they can't defend the pass it's the entire way they seem to lose these games.

    Giving too much cushion

    Players that can't tackle

    Out of position

    Lack of a pass rush

    Not enough blitzing

    Never finding the anwser to stop Tom Brady and the cheats despite the head coach

    Just seems like some games they are so in tune and then other games, they are totally off in a different direction.

    Here, this was for all you Arian lovers.
    Why does it have to be "for all of you Arians lovers". I mean seriously, are we in 5th grade? Nobody loves Bruce Arians except Ben Roethlisberger.

    Everyone knows Arians sucks. I've spent seasons ragging on him. He is what he is at the point and we've won Superbowls with it and won a Superbowl on the back of his offense when the Defense surrendered a huge lead.. Arians' offenses don't produce points for the yardage that they consume. Play calling is often skeptical but I also won't be like Jerry Glanville and blame play calling when execution sucks or when the opposing defense happens to simply make a good play like everyone is capable of. In some people's worlds, when the Steelers last had a good defense in 2008, it was never the Defense that was good, it was that the opposing offenses had terrible Offensive Coordinators that always called the wrong plays. Common Sense and Logic dictates this to be completely untrue, yet this is how most people really think in reverse.

    The bottom line is that we can sit around and make 10 threads a day and make 5 of them directly after a Steelers game saying that Bruce Arians needs fired or whatever it may be, but come playoffs time, it's going to be this half assed **** poor Pass Defense that prevents us from advancing when Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, Phillip Rivers etc... are eating it alive. The usual narrow minded "common" fans will say "we should've scored more" despite surrendering a lead late in games, wining the time of possession game and having team and fan momentum..

    My point is that we need to start to turning our attention to the very thing that has declined big time since our last super Bowl win and visit to the playoffs in 2008 - Pass Defense. That's the true story. Not an offense that at worst isn't much better than the 2008 offense
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    Default Re: It's Time For LeBeau's Pass Defense To Step Up

    Could possibly Lebeau not be showing all of his cards on D with the playoffs coming up. From what I understand, teams generally take the last 4 games and watch them and scrutinized them. Throwing something in that you plan on using for the playoffs (a surprise coverage scheme or blitz package, for example) for the other teams to find a way to beat that package might not be the best.

    While I do worry about the defense, I'm thinking that it might be possible that this is all a matter of the chess game played between coaches.

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    Default Re: It's Time For LeBeau's Pass Defense To Step Up

    Quote Originally Posted by LasVegasGuy View Post
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    Right it's time to start blaming Lebeau . Here is a little stat for you.

    Patriots
    21st in points allowed
    28th in total yards allowed
    30th in passing yards allowed
    15th in rushing yards allowed

    12-2, beat teams like the Steelers, Jets, Ravens, Chargers, Colts, Bears & Packers and have a firm grasp on the #1 seed. When the offense is clicking and scoring points for the defense does it really ****ing matter about the stats?


    Steelers
    2nd in points allowed
    3rd in total yards allowed
    24th in passing yards allowed
    1st in rushing yards allowed

    10-4 and hanging on for dear life.


    Your absolutely right we need to blame Lebeau.
    Of course you didn't read the article or my stats. If you did tyou wouldn't have offered up this redundant sack of crap you wasted your time with?

    I concentrated on Pass Defense. Let me make that bold and make it bigger since you appear to be unable and unwilling to read PASS DEFENSE

    When you have a pass defense that isn't surrendering about 271 yards per game to teams that are Ranked 15th or better in Pass Offense, you have a legit chance to beat anyone. We had that type of team in 2008 against San Diego, Indianapolis, Dallas, Houston etc... The Green Bay packers WITHOUT Aaron Rogers almost beat the Patriots but they wouldn't have even had a chance if their Pass Defense didn't limit Tom Brady to 163 yards on 15-24 passing. You limit Brady to that and have a QB that is better than Matt Flynn, you are getting the Patriots offense off the field and you are giving your own offense more chances and more time.

    It's pretty simple when you don't think like you do.
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    Default Re: It's Time For LeBeau's Pass Defense To Step Up

    Quote Originally Posted by GeoPittsburghFan View Post
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    Could possibly Lebeau not be showing all of his cards on D with the playoffs coming up. From what I understand, teams generally take the last 4 games and watch them and scrutinized them. Throwing something in that you plan on using for the playoffs (a surprise coverage scheme or blitz package, for example) for the other teams to find a way to beat that package might not be the best.

    While I do worry about the defense, I'm thinking that it might be possible that this is all a matter of the chess game played between coaches.
    One would love to believe that but I think highly unlikely. This isn't Rocky where he fights right handed up until the last round and then switches to the left to throw Apollo off. There were still many rounds for him to get knocked out before the switch. Up until our embarassing loss to the offensive-less Jets we weren't in the playoffs yet so what you saw yesterday is what you are going to get in the playoffs.

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    Default Re: It's Time For LeBeau's Pass Defense To Step Up

    Quote Originally Posted by Kipper View Post
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    Of course you didn't read the article or my stats. If you did tyou wouldn't have offered up this redundant sack of crap you wasted your time with?

    I concentrated on Pass Defense. Let me make that bold and make it bigger since you appear to be unable and unwilling to read PASS DEFENSE

    When you have a pass defense that isn't surrendering about 271 yards per game to teams that are Ranked 15th or better in Pass Offense, you have a legit chance to beat anyone. We had that type of team in 2008 against San Diego, Indianapolis, Dallas, Houston etc... The Green Bay packers WITHOUT Aaron Rogers almost beat the Patriots but they wouldn't have even had a chance if their Pass Defense didn't limit Tom Brady to 163 yards on 15-24 passing. You limit Brady to that and have a QB that is better than Matt Flynn, you are getting the Patriots offense off the field and you are giving your own offense more chances and more time.

    It's pretty simple when you don't think like you do.
    How do you explain the Patriots 30th ranked pass defense and their 12-2 record. We have a better pass defense and a worse record. Could the problem just be coaching?

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    Default Re: It's Time For LeBeau's Pass Defense To Step Up

    Quote Originally Posted by GeoPittsburghFan View Post
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    Could possibly Lebeau not be showing all of his cards on D with the playoffs coming up. From what I understand, teams generally take the last 4 games and watch them and scrutinized them. Throwing something in that you plan on using for the playoffs (a surprise coverage scheme or blitz package, for example) for the other teams to find a way to beat that package might not be the best.

    While I do worry about the defense, I'm thinking that it might be possible that this is all a matter of the chess game played between coaches.
    I doubt it. We've been pretty poor in Pass Defense all of last season as well. A lot of the same issues are present this year. One of the main problems is that we aren't getting pressure on the QB. Either we aren't blitzing enough or the blitzes aren't as effective. I'm not sure but what ever it is we aren't getting pressure on the QB and it's leaving what has always been a mediocre secondary prone to be picked apart. Some of the decisions on defense are odd as well. Against the Jets, I saw two instances where the Jets had 3rd and short. We had McFadden playing about 10 yards off the WR and Sanchez completed a bubble pass for an easy first down. Another time Sanchez (as he did all game) made another 3rd and short completion but he had time. What was odd was that James Harrison was back in coverage. When it's 3rd down, you should have your best pass rushers rushing the passer and getting him to throw too soon etc... We had some instances where it seems like we were more concerned about playing coverage than pressuring the QB. That philosophy is going to get us killed against better QB's.

    It's all a chess game and things come down to execution too but look at 2008. We wouldn't make it past San Diego with this pass defense in the playoffs. That's my concern and reason for this Article. It's about everyone thinking the Offense is the achillies heel of the team going forward when I see the Pass Defense as the very thing that's nose dived since our last visit to the playoffs.
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    Default Re: It's Time For LeBeau's Pass Defense To Step Up

    Quote Originally Posted by LasVegasGuy View Post
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    How do you explain the Patriots 30th ranked pass defense and their 12-2 record. We have a better pass defense and a worse record. Could the problem just be coaching?
    So, 31 other Head Coaches should be fired as well, right? Well except for Eric Mangini and half of Rex Ryan?

    Do you understand that your estrogen laced statements are simply stupid on logic and common sense?


    Remember ... 2007 New York Giants

    The 2010 Patriots maybe this is the year they win their 4th SB. Maybe they are just the 2007 Lite version which is more than likely. I really don't give a **** what the Patriots record is because it makes no difference in the Regular Season at all right now. It says about as much about what they will do in the Playoffs as the 2004 Steelers who were 15-1. It says about as much as all of those 200's Indianapolis colts teams that annually had one of the Top or 2nd best records in the AFC and 2 SB appearances to show for it.

    Dan Marino had great offenses for of his career. How'd that do him in the playoffs?
    Last edited by Kipper; Dec-20-2010 at 11:41 AM.
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    Default Re: It's Time For LeBeau's Pass Defense To Step Up

    Quote Originally Posted by LasVegasGuy View Post
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    One would love to believe that but I think highly unlikely. This isn't Rocky where he fights right handed up until the last round and then switches to the left to throw Apollo off. There were still many rounds for him to get knocked out before the switch. Up until our embarassing loss to the offensive-less Jets we weren't in the playoffs yet so what you saw yesterday is what you are going to get in the playoffs.
    Oh yeah. When we were 15-1, that was what we were going to see in the playoffs in 2004 too, right? Undefeated 2007 Patriots were supposed to win the Super bowl right? The 14-2 Colts of 2005 weren't suppose to lose a to an inferior wildcard Steelers team, right?

    Your logic is flawed it's would be an insult to logic to even define what you are spewing is even called that. all you are doing is proposing over dramatic opinion on par with how a woman usually acts when a pair of pants doesn't fit anymore
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    Default Re: It's Time For LeBeau's Pass Defense To Step Up

    Quote Originally Posted by Kipper View Post
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    son. I think you should probably stop
    I'd swear I read that and heard it in Foghorn Leghorn's voice.

    The Pats argument is trotted out with a depressing regularity. I'm prepared to be a bit more pragmatic about it.

    The D needs to start finding the extra gear and earn that bye. That is all (for now).
    'I want rustlers, cut throats, murderers, bounty hunters, desperados, mugs, pugs, thugs, nitwits, halfwits, dimwits, vipers, snipers, con men, Indian agents, Mexican bandits, muggers, buggerers, bushwhackers, hornswogglers, horse thieves, bull dykes, train robbers, bank robbers, ***-kickers, ****-kickers and Methodists.'

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    Default Re: It's Time For LeBeau's Pass Defense To Step Up

    Quote Originally Posted by Kipper View Post
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    I doubt it. We've been pretty poor in Pass Defense all of last season as well. A lot of the same issues are present this year. One of the main problems is that we aren't getting pressure on the QB. Either we aren't blitzing enough or the blitzes aren't as effective. I'm not sure but what ever it is we aren't getting pressure on the QB and it's leaving what has always been a mediocre secondary prone to be picked apart. Some of the decisions on defense are odd as well. Against the Jets, I saw two instances where the Jets had 3rd and short. We had McFadden playing about 10 yards off the WR and Sanchez completed a bubble pass for an easy first down. Another time Sanchez (as he did all game) made another 3rd and short completion but he had time. What was odd was that James Harrison was back in coverage. When it's 3rd down, you should have your best pass rushers rushing the passer and getting him to throw too soon etc... We had some instances where it seems like we were more concerned about playing coverage than pressuring the QB. That philosophy is going to get us killed against better QB's.

    It's all a chess game and things come down to execution too but look at 2008. We wouldn't make it past San Diego with this pass defense in the playoffs. That's my concern and reason for this Article. It's about everyone thinking the Offense is the achillies heel of the team going forward when I see the Pass Defense as the very thing that's nose dived since our last visit to the playoffs.
    Maybe if our offense gave the defense a cushion we could be a little more creative on defense. We could call the defense around what WE KNOW the offense is going to do. When the games are close, like many Steeler games, the defense is off balance because the offense for the other team can still pass or run at their leisure. Rarely in the Tomlin era do we make the other team one sided and when we do (i.e Raiders) it can get ugly pretty ****ing fast.

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    Default Re: It's Time For LeBeau's Pass Defense To Step Up

    Quote Originally Posted by Kipper View Post
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    Oh yeah. When we were 15-1, that was what we were going to see in the playoffs in 2004 too, right? Undefeated 2007 Patriots were supposed to win the Super bowl right? The 14-2 Colts of 2005 weren't suppose to lose a to an inferior wildcard Steelers team, right?

    Your logic is flawed it's would be an insult to logic to even define what you are spewing is even called that. all you are doing is proposing over dramatic opinion on par with how a woman usually acts when a pair of pants doesn't fit anymore
    Whatever man, your blaming the pass defense and I am saying look at the Patriots. We are ranked 24th and they are ranked 30th. I still haven't heard your logic as to why they are getting by just fine and we are struggling. Forget all the other nonsense about this and that. Explain to me how or pass defense is our achilles heel when it isn't for the Pats.

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    Default Re: It's Time For LeBeau's Pass Defense To Step Up

    Quote Originally Posted by LasVegasGuy View Post
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    Whatever man, your blaming the pass defense and I am saying look at the Patriots.

    Im saying **** the patriots. they arent important. you're obsessed

    We are ranked 24th and they are ranked 30th. I still haven't heard your logic as to why they are getting by just fine and we are struggling. Forget all the other nonsense about this and that. Explain to me how or pass defense is our achilles heel when it isn't for the Pats.
    Houston Texans

    They are ranked 31st in Pass Defense and ranked 5th in Offense, higher than the Patriots.

    Why aren't they 12-2. using your flawed logic, the Houston Texans should be 12-2 since they have an offense that helps overcome a terrible pass defense, right?

    Answers? I

    how comes 8 teams with better Offenses than the Patriots aren't 12-2? since apparently using your flawed logic, only "Offense" matters. If you have Offense then you can be 12-2.

    defense wins Championships. If it didn't the 2007 Patriots wouldn't have lost to the Giants who according to your flawed logic should never have beaten the Patriots.

    this is like picking apart the steelers secondary

    The bottom line is that it doesn't matter what the Patriots are doing but it does matter that the Steelers Pass Defense against teams with Top 15 pass offenses would be ranked about 31st in the league. We didn't have that problem in 2008 when we coasted through the playoffs.
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